I Already Knew That

In a previous post (I Can’t Know Until I See), I explained that the phrase “perfect knowledge” as used in the scriptures is frequently misunderstood—including by me, until recently. I still wouldn’t say I completely understand what is meant by the phrase, but I have ruled out one possibility.

Perfect Knowledge as Seeing God

My notion of “perfect knowledge” came mostly from Ether 3. This is how I used to explain it: faith is believing in something even though you’re not sure. Moriancumer1 had faith in God but not a perfect knowledge. He exercised his faith long enough that the veil was parted and he got to see the Lord. Because he had seen God, he now had a perfect knowledge. That is, “perfect knowledge” means you’ve seen God.

With such an understanding, I would have diagrammed the relationship between faith, seeing God, and perfect knowledge like this:

Faith --- See God --- Perfect knowledge

What Really Happened on the Mountain

However, I noticed that when you read the story of the brother of Jared closely, that is not the sequence presented. Three different times in the chapter it states that Moriancumer had a perfect knowledge before he pierced the veil and saw the Lord.

And when he had said these words, behold, the Lord showed himself unto him, and said: Because thou knowest these things ye are redeemed from the fall; therefore ye are brought back into my presence; therefore I show myself unto you. (Ether 3:13)

And because of the knowledge of this man he could not be kept from beholding within the veil; and he saw the finger of Jesus, which, when he saw, he fell with fear; for he knew that it was the finger of the Lord;
And he had faith no longer, for he knew, nothing doubting. Wherefore, having this perfect knowledge of God, he could not be kept from within the veil; therefore he saw Jesus; and he did minister unto him. (Ether 3:19–20)2

The chapter heading even emphasizes this sequence: “Those who have a perfect knowledge cannot be kept from within the veil.” In all these passages, it is clear that by the time Moriancumer saw the Lord with his own eyes, he already had a perfect knowledge. Thus, we should correct the diagram to show the following sequence:

Faith --- Perfect knowledge --- See God

If Moriancumer had a perfect knowledge before he ever saw God, that means that having a perfect knowledge is not contingent on seeing God. So whatever a “perfect knowledge” is, it does not mean “knowing for sure because you’ve seen God face to face.” The very purpose of the account of Moriancumer’s mountain experience seems to be to teach that you can have a perfect knowledge without seeing God.

Implications

One reason I think this is significant is that it leads us to consider faith, not as a placeholder for real knowledge, but as a source of knowledge. Perhaps that is why Alma compared faith to planting a seed. A seed is not what we cling to until some day someone gives us a tree. A seed becomes a tree. When it sprouts we “have [a seed] no longer”—not because the seed was replaced by a tree, but because the seed eventually grew into a tree. Faith is not belief while in the absence of knowledge; faith is a source of knowledge. It is the process by which we gain knowledge.

Another reason this matters is that it keeps us from exalting sensory knowledge. Think of what my previous, incorrect understanding of “perfect knowledge” implied. If we can’t have perfect knowledge until after we’ve seen God, then that means that the purest, surest way of knowing something is through the five senses. If that were so, then why does Joseph Fielding Smith say, “A manifestation of an angel, or even the Son of God himself, would impress the eye and mind, and eventually become dimmed, but the impressions of the Holy Ghost sink deeper into the soul”?3

Many prophets have stated that revelation from the Holy Ghost is more powerful than seeing things with our own eyes. So it naturally follows that a perfect knowledge is not predicated on seeing God. The brother of Jared’s experience confirms that fact.



Notes

1. Joseph Smith identified the brother of Jared’s name as “Mahonri Moriancumer.” Since that can be a mouthful, and quickly becomes laborious to read, I prefer to use the shortened form that is found in Ether 2:13.

2. I have broken verse 19 from verse 20 in a different place than in the current edition of the Book of Mormon. I believe that in this case, it more clearly conveys the point being made.

3. Joseph Fielding Smith, Answers to Gospel Questions, 2:151; cited in Gospel Principles, p. 36.

7 comments

  1. I thought I’d wait to get the two parts of the series before commenting. Here are my thoughts.

    And it came to pass that when the brother of Jared had said these words, behold, the Lord stretched forth his hand and touched the stones one by one with his finger. And the veil was taken from off the eyes of the brother of Jared, and he saw the finger of the Lord; and it was as the finger of a man, like unto flesh and blood; and the brother of Jared fell down before the Lord, for he was struck with fear. (Ether 3: 6)

    First BoJ had faith, then veil was taken off of BoJ, then he saw finger, then BoJ fell down with fear.

    And the Lord saw that the brother of Jared had fallen to the earth; and the Lord said unto him: Arise, why hast thou fallen? And he saith unto the Lord: I saw the finger of the Lord, and I feared lest he should smite me; for I knew not that the Lord had flesh and blood. (Ether 3: 7-8)

    BoJ fell down in fear because he did not (previously) know that the Lord had flesh and blood.

    And the Lord said unto him: Because of thy faith thou hast seen that I shall take upon me flesh and blood; and never has man come before me with such exceeding faith as thou hast; for were it not so ye could not have seen my finger. Sawest thou more than this? (Ether 3: 9)

    It was the faith (not knowledge) of BoJ that allowed him to see the finger of the Lord.

    And he answered: Nay; Lord, show thyself unto me. And the Lord said unto him: Believest thou the words which I shall speak? And he answered: Yea, Lord, I know that thou speakest the truth, for thou art a God of truth, and canst not lie. And when he had said these words, behold, the Lord showed himself unto him, and said: Because thou knowest these things ye are redeemed from the fall; therefore ye are brought back into my presence; therefore I show myself unto you. (Ether 3: 10-13)

    “Because thou knowest these things” is referring to seeing the finger of the Lord and obtaining a knowledge (by sight) that the Lord would take upon him flesh and blood. (See verse 9: “thou hast seen that I shall take upon me flesh and blood.”) BoJ did not have a perfect knowledge of this prior to seeing the finger of the Lord. It was seeing the finger that gave him this perfect knowledge.

    And because of the knowledge of this man he could not be kept from beholding within the veil; and he saw the finger of Jesus, which, when he saw, he fell with fear; for he knew that it was the finger of the Lord; and he had faith no longer, for he knew, nothing doubting. Wherefore, having this perfect knowledge of God, he could not be kept from within the veil; therefore he saw Jesus; and he did minister unto him. (Ether 3: 19, 20)

    “And because of the knowledge of this man” is referring to the perfect knowledge obtained by BoJ when he saw the finger of the Lord. It is not referring to prior to the vision. Moroni clarifies the statement by explaining what knowledge he is talking about in the next clarifying phrases: “and he saw the finger of Jesus, which, when he saw, he fell with fear; for he knew that it was the finger of the Lord.” Then, having perfect knowledge he saw the rest of the body of Jesus, meaning that the entire veil was lifted.

    Now, concerning your implications: BoJ did not see the Lord’s spirit body with his natural eyes. He saw them with his spiritual eyes. See Moses 1: 11. Joseph Fielding Smith’s quote is referring to natural eyes, not the spiritual eyes. The quote means: “A manifestation of an angel, or even the Son of God himself, would impress the [natural] eye and mind, and eventually become dimmed, but the impressions of the Holy Ghost sink deeper into the soul[, the spiritual eyes.]” Angels are resurrected personages and can come without their glory. Jesus came among men in the flesh, without glory, so that men could see him with natural eyes. But visions of glory must be seen with spiritual eyes, so, even understanding Ether 3 as meaning perfect knowledge equates to sight, it doesn’t elevate sensory knowledge.

  2. Great comments, LDS Anarchist! I’m gonna have to read them a couple times to digest them totally. I just had one thought for tonight:

    LDS Anarchist: “Because thou knowest these things” is referring to seeing the finger of the Lord and obtaining a knowledge (by sight) that the Lord would take upon him flesh and blood.

    That wasn’t how I read it. It seems to me that “these things” refers to the most recent thing mentioned—the statements that Moriancumer makes about the Lord’s attributes. Moriancumer says he knows three things:

    Yea, Lord, I know that thou [1] speakest the truth, for thou [2] art a God of truth, and [3] canst not lie. (v. 12)

    Immediately after which the Lord says,

    Because thou knowest these things ye are redeemed from the fall; therefore ye are brought back into my presence; therefore I show myself unto you. (v. 13)

    To me, the most natural reading is, because Moriancumer knew the Lord’s attributes of truthfulness, that was why the Lord showed himself to him. But you’ve given me a lot to think about, so I want to take the time to look at what you’ve written and reread Ether 3. Thanks!

    And by the way, I wanted to make sure you understand that when I quoted you in part one, I wasn’t trying to be critical or anything—I just did a quick Google search to try and find any quote that illustrated that interpretation. I hope I was representing you accurately. (In fact, one point I liked about that series was the idea that God exercises faith in some form. I haven’t had the chance to read the whole thing, but that’s one idea I saw that I think is important for people to know.)

  3. LDS Anarchist: Visions of glory must be seen with spiritual eyes, so, even understanding Ether 3 as meaning perfect knowledge equates to sight, it doesn’t elevate sensory knowledge.

    I don’t know if you’re still following this article or website, LDS Anarchist, but I think I finally was able to articulate something about your comments that I didn’t understand.

    When you say spiritual eyes, are you speaking literally or figuratively? Because if it’s literal, then it is sensory knowledge—just on a different plane from our regular five senses. If it’s figurative, then it represents some other process for gaining knowledge. I suspect that process is faith, like gaining knowledge through the Spirit.

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